lapierre is extreme on guns and paul krugman is extreme on debt. they sort of occupy their own alternative universeses and the question is whether the republicans are going to have the guts to stand up to lapierre and whether democrats will be strong enough to walk away from krugman. but we'll see what happens. if it's way too early, what time is it? >> it's time for "morning joe". >> tell us. >> it's time for "morning joe," but now it's time for "the daily rundown" with chuck todd. have a great day. happy valentine's day! the posturing around chuck hagel's nomination for a defense secretary, well, it's getting murkier by the minute. are republicans gearing up to deny an up or down vote for the pentagon kick before the weekend? president obama's road show policy push hits atlanta today and we'll take a deep dive into the options and odds of the president having to fall back on executive actions, because his policies won't go anywhere in

congress. and the republican ruckus over karl rove's conservative counter-strategy is reaching a bit of a fever pitch. but is the core of this fight really about the messengers or the message itself? >> good morning from washington and happy valentine's day. it's thursday, february 14th, 2013. this is "the daily rundown." i'm chuck todd. let's get right to my first reads of the morning. it may be valentine's day, but not a lot of love for chuck hagel. next week a nato meeting of defense ministers is scheduled in brussels. but given the way chuck hagel's nomination is going, it's possible the u.s. may not have a new defense secretary there or leon panetta may be forced to go there steed. yesterday, the senate began the odd procedural dance that is required for cloture, the process for ending senate debate. >> nomination, department of defense, charles timothy hagel of nebraska, to be secretary of defense. >> mr. president, i sent a cloture motion to the desk and ask the clerk to report.

this is the first time in the history of our country that a presidential nominee for secretary of defense has been filibustered. what a shame. >> the requirement of 60 votes for a cabinet appointee is almost unprecedented. only two cabinet appointments have ever been filibustered, according to the senate historian's office. verity in 1978 and dirk kempthorne. no appointment has ever been successfully filibustered, by the way. yesterday, senator jim inhofe, ranking member of the armed services committee, claimed republicans weren't filibust filibustering. really, they're not. >> this is not a filibuster. i keep getting stopped by people out in the hall, oh, you're going to filibuster, who's going to filibuster? it's not a filibuster. all they have to do is have a 60-vote margin. well, that's fine with me. if they have a 60-vote margin.

>> republicans say the more reid, quote, rushes this vote, the easier it is for them to rally 41 republicans to vote against ending debate. republicans who once were opposed to a filibuster on any grounds, even though they planned to vote no, are sounding a bit more, shall we say, squirrely on the issue. for instance, missouri senator roy blunt told me this two weeks ago on the show. >> would you support a filibuster of chuck hagel's nomination? >> i doubt it. i doubt it. certainly, my strong inclination would be that this is a vote that should be done by a majority, rather than a 60-vote standard. >> but yesterday, blunt said he believes it's too quick to end this debate on this nomination. on tuesday, senator john mccain stood up to his colleague, ted cruz, and defended hagel. >> senator hagel is an honorable man. he has served his country and no one on this committee at any time should impugn his character or his integrity.

>> but yesterday, mccain told politico he hasn't made up his mind on a filibuster and was waiting to see whether the white house will respond to a letter requesting more information about not hagel, but about obama's actions and orders the night of the benghazi attack. quote, we are hoping to get an answer to a simple question. and what did the president do during benghazi is now becoming a rallying cry. >> know the debate on chuck hagel is not over. it has not been serious. we don't have the information we need. and i am going to fight the idea of jamming somebody through. i'm going to hit you and keep hitting you, absolutely! you're not going to get away with not answering basic questions. >> the vote is going to be close. and senate democrats are bracing themselves for republicans denying them 60 votes. two republican senators are supporting hagel's confirmation. a third senator, suzanne collins, said she will not support a filibuster, though she came out against hagel

yesterday, saying this. "i do not believe his past positions, votes, and statements match the positions of our times." the white house remains confident it can get 60 votes and beat the gop filibuster, while republicans are hoping that the longer they delay the process, that there's a chance another shoe might drop. yesterday, outgoing defense secretary leon panetta joked about how long the confirmation process is taking. >> there are moments when i thought i was part of the last act of an italian opera and not sure exactly when it would end and when the fat lady would sing. >> and panetta lectured congress, saying the relationship between the administration and congress is now one of his biggest disappointments. >> we need to find solutions. we can't just sit here and [ bleep ]. we can't just sit here and complain. we can't just sit here and blame others. we have got to solve real problems facing this country. this country is facing some real threats in the world.

>> that's right. we had to [ bleep ] secretary panetta. we joked about this as an issue during our interview with secretary panetta. we didn't have to bleep him then, but we did have to bleep him yesterday. anyway, just ask yourself, though, confirmation hearings, they may not be decisive, but they do matter. ask yourself while john brennan and jack lew are frankly having an easier confirmation process. no -- wasn't exactly going through scot-free, but they had good hearings. they aced the hearing part of the confirmation. hagel was a borderline disaster on style for his confirmation hearing and he certainly struggled on substance. and that's where we are. and by the way, if hagel does get through, he's going to go in as a very, very weak secretary of defense, that has to be wearing on the mind of the folks that sit in the west wing. jack reed is the president on line one. anyway, president obama's outside game is clear. he's on the road, pushing a raft of politically popular initiatives, daring republicans

to essentially fall into a political trap of opposing them. but does the president have an inside game with a legislative strategy to actually get any of these things done? the president heads today to an atlanta area preschool and recreation center and he'll push a plan for high-quality preschool for every child. a plan he rolled out on tuesday night. >> in states that make it a priority to educate our youngest children, like georgia or oklahoma, studies show students grow up more likely to read and do math at grade level, graduate high school, hold a job. i propose working with states to make high-quality preschool available to every single child in america. >> "the atlanta journal-constitution" reports that the college heights early child learning center is on break and will convene today just for the purpose of the president's vote. the school wrote to president,

we are offering a one-day experience for pre-k and head start on the day of the president's visit. they would meet state-level standards for early learning, proof of qualified teachers, and an assessment plan. the proposal also expands head start. one thing the white house hasn't done, though, yet is put a price tag on this. they say that will come when they unveil their budget. wednesday at a north carolina engine parts factory plant, the president says it's now up to congress to support his agenda. >> i'm doing what i can, just through administrative action, but i need congress to help, i need congress to do their part. we just have to work together. we've got to stop with some of the politics that we see in washington sometimes, that's focused on who's up and who's down. >> but what evidence is there that republicans are listening? judging by the reaction of the state of the union address, not much. >> with the exception of his impressive delivery and trademark style, last night's

speech was pedestrian, liberal, boiler plate that any democratic lawmaker could have given at any time in recent memory. >> the white house may be setting something of a trap politically for republicans. in fact, some republicans are worried about this. the president is pushing proposals that are popular with the public. so even if he doesn't have a legislative strategy to get them passed. >> i believe we reward effort and determination with wages that allow working families to raise their kids and get ahead. if you work full-time, you shouldn't be poverty. >> white house appears to be hoping public pressure is enough to move things on capitol hill. but republicans aren't necessarily on board, coming out in force yesterday, for instance, against the president's minimum wage proposal. >> minimum wages instead of their maximum potential. >> when you raise the price of

employment, this is what happens. you get less of it. >> i think it's inflationary. i think it actually is counterproductive in many ways. you end up costing jobs from people who are at the bottom rung of the economic ladder. >> just because something sounds good at the outset doesn't mean it's a good idea. >> will we see the same opposition to universal pre-k today? it remains to be seen. but very quickly, i'm hearing the idea, if the white house strategy is just so that public pressure will move congress, it sounds like the plot to the movie "dave," not necessarily what actually is reality here in washington. >> speaking of the republican party, we are currently seeing two different splits. the first is establishment versus the tea party, karl rove versus club for growth, conservative groups, as well as haley barbour involved in that. after haley barbour said, according to the "national review," we kicked away four or five senate seats in the last two cycles by nominating candidates who did not have the best chance to win.

the club for growth should stop spending money to defeat republicans. the club fired back. "when he was thinking of running for president, barbour had nothing but nice things to say about us. now that he's back to his more familiar roles as a lobbyist than a republican party insider, he is singing a different tune." rove is taking a beating on conservative radio. listen to this from mark levin's show this week. >> who the health died and made karl rove queen for the day?! and his sidekick, steven law, with their disastrous records. >> it was really karl rove who gave us obama. $400 million was wasted. they do the worst ads i have ever seen, ever. >> on the show yesterday, former indiana senator richard lugar defended what rove and other establishment conservatives are trying to do. >> republicans who really want to see a majority in the senate know that in order to do that,

they really have to be able candidates or able to go the route who have a sense, at least, of independent thought, to have a majority when we have, really, a large majority of the public behind us. >> in all the hubbub over this split, don't miss that there's also a second split right now in the gop between washington and non-washington republicans. we pointed out yesterday, rubio's state of the union response was similar to any speech you'd hear from mourm moi mitt romney in twelve, except with the exception of his personal story. on the other hand, look at what republican governors are saying. people like louisiana's bobby jindal or new jersey's chris christie, arguing that the party should stop focusing so much on washington budget battles. even at times used washington conservatives as a punching bag. >> there's only one group to blame for the continued suffering of these innocent victims. the house majority and their speaker, john boehner. >> we have seemed to have an

obsession with government bookkeeping. this is a rigged game and it is the wrong game for us to play. >> as we look ahead to 2016, rubio and the jindals and christies of the world represent two different schools of thinking in terms of how to rebrand the party and how to fight obama. well, it's valentine's day, but love is not in the air, for anyone here in washington. what's new about that? up next, more on the republican party, at odds with itself, messenger and messaging. plus, what do they think of the obama agenda. with all the love lost, is it time for a breakup? we talk to tennessee congressman, marsha blackburn, who says it's time to get rid of the grand old party. but first, a look ahead, in today's politics planner, a lot of sequester hearings today. arne duncan on the hill, talking about that. secretary clinton getting an honor at the pentagon today. and of course, the president in atlanta, but he also does a google hangout. so get your head gear on.

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the divide within the republican party is on is display tuesday night. you had senator marco rubio and senator rand paul, both delivering separate responses to the president's state of the union. one trying to reach a broader audience and one targeting the base. will the party be able to come back together? joining me now is tennessee republican congressman, marcia bla blackburn. and we did that tease there, congresswoman, having to do with what you said about the grand old party. >> right. >> and since you're from tennessee, it's clear that the

only times you want to -- the only word you want to have after the word "grand old" is probable "o "opre." >> you're right. >> but explain to me what you meant by that, when you said over the weekend, that republicans need to get rid of the grand old party. >> absolutely. and this goes back to the convention when we were chairmanning the platform committee. i said, look, gop is our moniker. let's change it. we are the great opportunity party. we are the government of the people party. and chuck, i think that's what is going to unite us. we've got different groups that are having wonderful conversations and quite frankly, i have to tell you, we're a big tent. we love having this individual input, and that is what is going to bring energy and excitement to our party and put the focus on -- we are the party that believes in the individual, and the power of you.

>> do you believe you have a message problem or a messenger problem? >> i think it's a little bit of both, in that we have a good solid philosophical core. we have the right set of principles. sometimes, how we communicate that message gets a little bit muddled, and i think, many times, the messenger has a tendency to maybe not look as new and as fresh. and i appreciate so much governor jindal and senator rubio, and their passion for getting out there and making a difference. and in having messages that communicate and reach younger voters that get beyond the sides of our big tent party and bring more people in. invite people into the process. >> well, let me go through a couple of the president's proposals and see where you stand. on the minimum wage -- >> sure. >> do you see -- there are two parts to the president's proposals. one, he would like to see it

raised to $9 an hour. the second is this idea of indexing it to cost of living, which was actually something governor romney was for. where are you on both those issues? >> let me tell you something. i think that, basically, what the president is saying is we want individuals to make more. i'm not for raising the minimum wage, and this is why. you're going to exclude a lot of younger workers. i tell you what else i'm not for, is this requirement in obama care for providing health insurance for anybody that is working 30 hours plus. that is going to restrict the earnings of a lot of young people. and as i'm talking to moms out there, one of their primary concerns is that their children no longer have the opportunity to go in and get a job at a training wage or a minimum wage and then be mentored into learning how to be responsible, getting that paycheck, understanding the process. so why would you take a step

that is going to make it more difficult for employers to hire people? it makes no sense to me. >> isn't there an easy compromise on this, that majority adult, 18 or other, minimum wage is one thing, and you have an apprentice wage or a training wage? >> well -- >> for under 18. >> and there are proposals that have been brought forward in that regard in years past, about that we have not seen this administration or, frankly, many of the groups and organizations move forward to support that. if you want to open doors -- >> but would you support -- does that mean that you could support raising the minimum wage for legal adults, but create some sort of compromise -- what's that? >> it means i would give it a serious look. and i would be thoughtful in my consideration of that. what we're hearing from moms and from schoolteachers is that there needs to be a lower entry level, so that you can get 16,

17, 18-year-olds into the process. chuck, i remember my first job, when i was working in a retail store, growing up, down there in laurel, mississippi. i was making like $2.15 an hour. and i was being taught how to responsibly handle those customer interactions. and i appreciated that opportunity. >> let me ask you about the universal pre-k proposal that the president, and that's what he's pitching today. and he's proposed this idea of creating a federal/state partnership of figuring out how to -- as the state comes up with a plan, then the federal government will help. where are you on this? >> well, i have to tell you, like one of my teacher friends that e-mailed me after the president's speech and said, are you kidding me? because they're so overwhelmed right now with all of the paperwork that they have. and i think that there are thousands of teachers across this country that heard that, and heard about federal

intervention, into this program. and they said, you know what, school boards, local school boards, state school boards, sight-based decision making, that needs to be left to us. we don't need dictates from washington, d.c. intervening and mandating and complicating -- >> well, it wasn't a mandate. it didn't sound like it was coming up with a mandate -- >> chuck todd -- >> it was saying that if a state comes up with a plan, the federal government will help you. >> well, and some of the states have come up with plans. but what they are saying is, federal government, we don't want your help. and many times, we're hearing from the states, they would rather get rid of all federal intervention into education and focus on letting the states, the counties, the cities, the local school sites handle the education issues. what we're doing with federal intervention is not working. and teachers and parents know best how to address these issues. >> all right. i'm going to leave it there.

marsha blackburn from great state of tennessee. >> happy valentine's day. >> home of the grand old opry. >> we like that grand old opri and we like the great opportunity party. >> thanks for coming on. >> sure. up next, another one of the president's picks in jeopardy. not the game show. plus, taking on the tea party. lindsey graham, one of the republicans that could be vulnerable to a conservative primary challenge, well, he's getting a little help from some very wealthy friends. but first, today's trivia question. in honor of valentine's day, senators dixie graves and elaine edwards were both given what honor by their husbands? first person to tweet the correct answer to both my twitter feed @chucktodd and @the dailyrundown will now get a check out on the air. our graphics handle is ready to go to get your twitter handle, assuming it isn't totally offensive. my mother made the best toffee in the world. it's delicious. so now we've turned her toffee into a business.

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on my radar this morning, another nomination finds some drama, even before it gets to capitol hill, setting up a senate campaign with a little trash talk and securing some big bucks to prevent a potential primary problem. but first, some senate primary posturing. in a fund-raising letter for his senate campaign, georgia congressman paul brown has staked out an unusual claim to fame regarding president obama. brown said, i was the first member of congress to call him a socialist, who embraces marxist policies like redistribution of wealth. okay, then. brown is currently the only republican officially running to replace saxby chambliss. meanwhile, other in south carolina, republican senator lindsey graham's allies are planning to form a super pac to help his re-election campaign. graham's recent voting record has drawn some anger from conservatives, specifically the club for growth, and has led to speculation that the senator could have a tough primary next

year. we'll see. some of the bigger, most likely challengers have said no, but if it happens, the new super pac gives more resources to graham, in addition to his already growing $4.4 million actual campaign account. and finally, nbc news has learned that general john allen is likely to withdraw his nomination to be the next nato supreme allied commander in europe. it's unclear why allen plans to withdraw, but several military officials told nbc news that he does not want to drag his family through a public process that could bring up e-mails that came to light during the resignation of cia director david petraeus. allen exchanged e-mails with tampa socialite joe kelly, and even though a subsequent review cleared allen of any inappropriate activity, yesterday defense secretary leon panetta said allen has been under a tremendous amount of pressure and urged the general to take some time on whether decides whether to take or leave the nato post. turning to the markets and a corporate marriage on valentine's day, american airlines and us airways have formally announced plans to merge, creating the world's largest air carrier.

that happens about every three years, doesn't it? this new airline will keep the american name and its ceo. it will offer 6,700 daily flights to nearly 60 countries. it's not the only big deal on wall street today. berkshire hathaway and 3g capital have agreed to buy heinz, a deal valued at more than $23 billion. the news sent the kech yaup maker's stock up more than 20%. should make for an interesting new closure report the next time we look at the john kerry and teresa heinz kerry scloefr reports. up next, power play. a deep dive in the president's plans to push ahead with some of his proposals with or without the help of congress. we'll talk to a guy who knows how that game is played on both ends of pennsylvania avenue, tom daschle will be here next. you're watching "the daily rundown," only on msnbc. ting li, marching band playing ] [ male announcer ] the rhythm of life. [ whistle blowing ] where do you hear that beat? campbell's healthy request soup lets you hear it... in your heart. [ basketball bouncing ] heart healthy. great taste. mmm... [ male announcer ] sounds good. it's amazing what soup can do.

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board, he'll look for ways to go it alone. today a deep dive into executive power. now the president plans to advance the proposals he laid out in the state of the union. >> if congress won't act soon to protect future generations, i will. i will direct -- i will direct my cabinet to come up with executive actions we can take, now and in the future. >> the president there was signaling out climate change as an issue he may address without congress. he may address new actions to protect struggling homeowners and protect gays in the workplace. he has also taken unilateral action to establish new standards for cybersecurity and to create new gun regulations. republicans like rand paul and jeff sessions, who spoke to cns news, says it's a mistake to bypass congress. >> we cannot and will not allow any president to act as if he were a king. we will not let any president use executive orders to impinge

on the second amendment. >> this president has already, in my opinion, pushed the envelope beyond the breaking point on executive orders, unilateral actions, actions that congress has specifically, openly rejected. >> of course, clashes between the executive and legislative branches are nothing new. more than a decade ago, vice president dick cheney singled out the democratic senate majority leader as the chief obstacle to president bush's republican agenda. >> tom daschle, unfortunately, has decided, i think in this case, to be more of an obstructionist. philosophical differences are fine. what we're seeing, though, unfortunately, is that efforts are being made here to artificially erect barriers to senate action. >> daschle, who served as senate minority leader, under a democratic president, and a majority leader under republican president, said his party was just doing its job. quote, there will be those occasions where we think the president is wrong, and in those cases, we will have no recourse but to stand up and argue our

positions and attempt to change the course of legislation he is proposing. well, joining me now is the man who made that statement, the only senator to serve as majority leader and minority leader more than once, south dakota democrat, tom daschle. nice to see you. one thing that i wonder about this, when it comes to the u.s. senate and when congress cares about the powers of the executive branches, it's usually the out party, the party that doesn't control the white house, that is suddenly concerned about the legislative branch of power. is that a cynically fair or unfair way of looking at it? >> i don't think it's cynical or unfair. i think it's actually true. obviously, the majority party sees itself as a partner with the president. i remember senator byrd once telling me to tell president clinton that we didn't work for him, we work with him. and we always looked at it that way. we didn't work for the administration, but we certainly work with him. and i think it's the minority party, generally, that's most concerned about the constitutional aspects of working with the new president.

>> so let me take the hague it'll example, for instance, right now. i'm curious of your thoughts, number one, on the idea that we could see a filibuster. now, you were in a senate that tried to filibuster a republican appointee. dirk kempthorne, we were just talking about that. any regrets about allowing a filibuster to go through like that? it failed, but allowing that to be put to a 60-vote threshold. >> well, looking back, i do think that filibusters are too often the recourse of the minority party when they disagree. i think, by and large, we ought to give the president to appoint his cabinet, appoint those key people in his administration, and certainly, this is one of those cases. so looking back, i do think minority parties on both sides oftentimes overuse that method for stalling or even stopping a nominee. >> and you're still friendly with a lot of these senators. do you think hagel gets -- do you think there's a successful -- do you think republicans find 41 votes to stall this nomination, at least? >> i think the republicans are on the defensive here. having to explain why they're filibustering a nominee.

why they're doing it, especially with a man like chuck hagel, who has a stellar reputation and an incredible set of credentials, as he takes on this position. so my guess is, you're going to find a handful of senators who are uncomfortable enough and will vote for cloture if it actually comes to a vote. >> i want to go back to how we set this up. this issue of when a president's dealing with a congress that he feels like he isn't working with and the turn to executive actions. i want to put up a statistic here. the president -- this president has averaged 36 executive orders a year. bush averaged 35 during his eight years. clinton averaged 44 during his eight years. bush had mostly republican majorities, but thin, on his side during his eight, six of his eight years, or 5 1/2, i guess, of his 8 years. clinton had mostly republican control on his side, and the president has had split. listening to the state of the union, were you surprised that the president had executive actions, as much as he did? sort of threats in there?

>> i really wasn't, chuck. first of all, i think this president, in particular, is very frustrated that so much of his agenda has been hindered and held back in large measure, because of political opposition. but i think that's true of any president. i've had conversations with presidents going back now for 20 years, all of whom, i think, are somewhat frustrated by the constitutional intransigence that occurs so oftentimes. not necessarily even political, just institutional. and that's true with regard to nominees, that's true with regard to the agenda itself, and it's true with so many other things. so this president is probably just illustrative of the latest example of that institutional frustration. >> do you think there was a little more to the phrase, they deserve a vote, that was more than just about gun legislation? >> no question. i think that's what the president's saying. they deserve a vote. not only on guns, but on immigration, on energy, and on a whole array of other issues that he laid out, i think very eloquently, the other night. >> but i guess, i don't know what the legislative strategy is. what is the legislative strategy

of the white house to get minimum wage passed, for instance. do you feel like you have a handle on this? >> i think the legislative strategy, initially, so to work with those key members who have the jurisdiction and who have the opportunity. but short of that, i think what he's going to do is put as much political pressure, speak to the american people, try to get as much of a ground swell of support in the grassroots and across the country on this agenda. so members are going to feel it from home as much as they feel it from the white house? >> now, every president, and i said this earlier, it feels like the plot to the movie "dave." that's how "dave" worked, right, oh, the public got behind him and the congress finally worked. >> i think you'd agree with me that immigration changed profoundly because the people voted and they sent a message about immigration through the demographics and through the election results. i don't think it's probably going to be that stark on some of these others issues, but clearly, it's not -- >> not impossible? >> not the exclusive vehicle, but it's a very effective one.

>> tom daschle, nice to see, thanks for sharing your wisdom on this front. as you know, he is the author of the new book, "the u.s. senate." you may have to put a new chapter in there when it comes to filibusters and defense secretaries, but it's the u.s. senate, fundamentals of american government. folks, you've got to learn it and this guy has been on all sides of it. all right, our gaggle will be here next. if love really means never having to say you're sorry, then capitol hill is overflowing with love. we'll get into the zeal against deals and the chances for some of this change. but first, white house soup of the day. loaded potato. it's a loaded agenda. don't forget, check out our website, rundown.msnbc.com. we'll be right back. [ whispering ] i've always preferred the crème part of an oreo. [ whispering ] that's crazy, the cookie's the best part. crème. cookie. crème. stop yelling. you stop yelling. [ whispering ] both of you stop yelling. [ whispering ] i'm trying to read. [ male announcer ] choose your side at oreo.com. tens of thousands of dollars in hidden fees on their 401(k)s?! go to e-trade and roll over your old 401(k)s

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game to get his second term agenda items accomplished? let's bring in our thursday gaggle, pulitzer prize-winning columnist, clarence paige from the "chicago tribune." cnbc contributor sharon taylor facten, and politico's senior reporter, welcome you all. sharon, i want to start with you. there are a lot of parallels here in some cases between what your boss tried to do in 2005 and what president obama is trying to do now. outside game, go find support, then play the inside game. that seems to be what the white house strategy is. didn't work for you guys and looking back, what advice would you give to president obama, lessons learned? >> well, it didn't work for george w. bush, in part, because he didn't have his own party aligned on south carolina. so i think the president does have his party aligned on many of his agendas. >> so that one advantage that he has. >> it has one advantage.

i think, though, he is a very ambitious agenda for this next year. he would be wise to focus on something that can get done. and that's immigration reform. and so, he's focused on minimum wage, he's focusing on these manufacturing zones, popular, popular with his base. >> but popular overall, so they're going to poll really well. >> they're going to poll really well, but at the end of the day, is the minimum wage really going to get increased? probably not. but what could get done, and what could get the economy moving or help move it is immigration reform. and he should be focused on that. >> clarence, so that goes to this, is it an expansive -- did he try to put too many things on the item with no legislative agenda, that you sit there and say, a legislative strategy, get some of this done. or is it smart to go ahead and try to create a political wedge? >> well, i think one thing that president bush had working against him was, touching social security, the proverbial -- >> which is why his own party went with him. >> very hard.

>> obama's got the wind at his back, even on minimum wage, which economic theory says, raising minimum wage kills jobs, but political reality is, minimum wage is very popular and it's popular with democrats in congress, it's popular with the general public, and republicans are going to lose politically, i think, if they really stand -- >> and let me bring jonathan in here. i guess that's my next question, is that you see the republican response, are they -- do republicans fall into a trap here, where they oppose him, they block it, but it gives the democrats something -- >> something to run on, yes. there are a lot of republicans in washington who think that this is less of an agenda and more of a 2014 campaign strategy that you try to bait a lot of republicans, they don't bring on the votes up in the house, and then harry truman style, president obama runs in 2014 against the do-nothing congress to try to take back the house. and then in this final two years, pushes a lot of his agenda through. i do, though, think, that it's

pretty clear the president does want to get immigration done. i think one of the most telling things that wasn't really said in that speech tonight was the immigration issue. what he didn't say on it was fascinating. >> right, he basically praised the bipartisan, said, you guys are doing great. keep it going. >> it seems very clear that senator schumer and some of the wise democrats on the hill have made clear to this president, let us do this. we got this! >> but i want to go to this, how would you tell washington republicans to respond to some of these things, because you do politically put the party in a rough place. and you see that that's, you know, it's going to be unpopular to be looking like you're suddenly falling into the class warfare. >> you're right. it is a very tricky appropriation for republicans. that said, i think they need to rise above and get into a broader discussion about debt and deficit and the long-term economic vitality of this country, and what's needed. and all of these things the president is supporting, they're all piecemeal solutions to what

we all know, which is, we really need an entitlement reform and tax reform in this country, if we want to have sustained economic growth. we have to get above those little fights and get on to a broader discussion. >> but i guess what i feel like is missing is, i can't sit here and say, okay, this is the republican plan for job creation right now, other than -- >> i think that's a challenge. >> like, what is it? i can't quickly -- clarence? >> that's quite right. and republicans are very divided over what their agenda is when you get down to specifics on job creation, on immigration, a pathway to citizenship, or more border security. that's an issue that indicates that the 2014 campaign is already beginning. >> i was just going to say, i go back to the bobby jindal comment, where he said, washington has got to stop sounding like they're bookkeepers. >> right. and i think he's gotten so much attention for the stupid party, because that's a sound bite. but i think the more insightful comment he's made in the last few months is just that.

it's the fact that all folks in the country see republicans talking about is some fiscal reference to some insider turn, be it sequestration or fiscalcl. that's not an agenda. >> nobody loves their accountant. nobody loves their accountant. >> that's right. >> you know you need one, you know you have to have one, but nobody loves them. in honor of valentine's day, we ask, senators dixie graves and elaine edwards were given what honor by their husbands? the answer, a senate seat. they are the only two wives to be appointed to the senate by their husbands who were, well, governors at the time. congratulations to today's winner at tdapple. e-mail us at dailyrundown@msnbc.com. we'll be right back. my doctor told me calcium is efficiently absorbed in small continuous amounts. citracal slow release continuously releases calcium plus d

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live pictures here of capitol hill. this is where the senate -- this is a senate appropriations committee holding a hearing on the impacts of sequestration. arne duncan, shawn donovan, all among the witnesses that testify today. those complaining about the nondefense parts of the cuts, let's bring back the gaggle. i want to go to hagel really fast. jonathan, are you surprised that hagel's gotten to the brink of this? at this point where we don't know in the next 48 hours, essentially, what are john mccain and roy blunt going to do? >> i think he's gotten to this point because -- >> i say that because they are the two on the fence that we know publicly. >> on performance -- look, i think if he had not shown up and had that performance in front of the senate armed services committee. there would have been grumbles, but he would've gotten confirmed fairly easily. because of that performance now, you've got republicans who were probably going to cast a no vote

against him or attempt to try to block it. >> you look at the obvious answer is look at jack lew and john brennan. the set-ups were the same, but they both were very impressive. >> they performed. and it's not only how he performed, it's, chuck hagel wouldn't win a popularity contest among senators, and that matters in that close-knit group of people. but this is bigger than hagel at this point. this is really about some republican senators wanting to send a message to the white house. >> right. >> you have to answer our questions. >> and it goes -- >> by the way, chuck hagel, clarence, let's say he gets in, it's a weak secretary of defense. that's not healthy to run the pentagon is it? >> this is what obama wants, though. >> you think he wants a weak secretary of defense? >> he's critical of defense spending and that's the kind of -- >> don't you think he wants someone to run the place the. >> he's popular with us ex-enlisted men. let me point this out. >> you bring up a good point. >> the policy at the pentagon or

wherever else -- >> shameless plug. >> pets alive, a rescue organization in new york. check it out, petsalive.com. >> all right. mr. page? >> all right, the new republic read in the "new york times," two very good pieces on how the republican party can bring blacks back into the party again. very important issue, i think. >> great behind the scenes piece on politico today, my colleague alex burns about how all of these grass roots conservative outfits in the crossroads project, by the same two pr firms in the beltway. >> there you go. that's it for this edition of the "daily rundown." our shameless plug is to all spouses out there. happy valentine's day. i'm speaking for everybody here at the table. don't worry. upcoming election on iran. we'll take a deep dive into that. how the power struggle there could influence talks. coming up next chris jansing. bye-bye. hey! did you know that honey nut cheerios has oats that can help lower cholesterol?

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